Chelan

I have owed chelan my attention for a while.

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You are turn

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Patience.

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My turn.

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Now I must answer chelan

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yes

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Hello chelan

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Hi.

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Now chelan must answer me.

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Now I must answer chelan.

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Now chelan must answer me

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Now I must answer chelan.

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Now chelan must answer me

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Now I must answer chelan.

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YOUR TURN

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It's been my turn for nine days and I have failed to alert the public in a timely manner.

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Hmm?

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Chelan visited spacehey only to browse.

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Why did you do this?

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It's impolite to not respond to people.

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Then you must again answer me

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Sure

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Now chelan must answer me.

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Now I must answer chelan

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yes
Sure
yes

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Sure

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yes

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Sure

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I don't have any tea that I like currently, but I may be able to make hot chocolate.

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What tea do you have?

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No, they've mostly been lost to the sands of time. I currently have only one ball and one nut on my desk. I have however acquired the prescribing information for 15 different drugs and placed them on my desk.

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How

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Theft

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A return to inactivity. Precedented.

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Reactivity.

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Chelan activity is directly proportional to how much you remind me that this website exists.

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CHELAN CHELAN CHELAN

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Now you're migadu. Spacehey has been demoted to fawkes news only.

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I am all niche forms of human interaction to chelan. Also I like that out chats are migadu instead of email or gooberweb in your eyes.

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Ghosted by chelan

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Eons have passed

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I'm one of those words

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You are chelan.

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Sawdust.

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So true

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My limited attention span is in the process of moving on from spacehey, it seems. I applied to a research internship thing and started taking a psychology course. What have you been u[ to?

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Chelan I am taking eighteen hours of college credit and I work part time. If I pick up a hobby I will die.

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What classes?

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truth

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Technical writing (kinda)
Being a lawyer (kinda)
Making music (kinda)
Public speaking?
Programming in Ruby, C#, a little bit of C
Listing the names and attributes of 37 of the top 200 most common drugs

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Chelan, we need to become better friends, because each of these sounds like an incredibly interesting character trait.

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The last one is more of a punishment for my sins than a character trait, but feel free to ask me anything about anything

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Death.

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I am playing a pirated game right now.

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How do you feel about it?

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Unrepentant. There's no reason digital art should be considered private property. If somebody wants to support a developer, that's excellent, and also why shit like Patreon exists, but there's nothing wrong with piracy when it comes to art.

I feel quite confident in this for two reasons. Copying a pattern of bits doesn't restrict anyone else's ability to use that pattern of bits. The only reason theft is wrong is because whoever you steal from loses that thing, but that doesn't apply here. It's ridiculous how, given a commodity without scarcity, we artificially create scarcity so that it can fit into our society. The other reason is that I don't believe that there will be a shortage of good art if IP rights are removed. Maybe basic bitches that subsist on multimillion dollar productions would disagree, but to me, the best art is made by small groups of people with a genuine interest in what they're doing. Artist patronage and pay-what-you-want are excellent models for this.

I'm more on the fence when it comes to IP rights for things more in the category of technology and design. It's still true that use of a pattern of bits does not preclude anyone else's use of those bits, but I think it's much more likely that the inability to make a profit would result in a significant shortage of new technology, as the profit motive is what drives a lot of technology. In this case, I think it may be reasonable to enforce IP rights to a limited extent. My intuition is to allow control over the information until a certain amount of revenue has been generated (say, 300% of the cost of production) or until a certain amount of time has passed. I haven't really thought that through, though, and I'm sure there's a lot of ways in which that could go wrong.

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We have weirdly similar and different takes on this issue. I do not believe in any form of copyright, but I still don't pirate games unless I deem the company producing the game unethical, which leads me to only pirate games once every few years.

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I think the problem with your intuition is that it's arbitrary, and I'd imagine that the development of technology is more likely to happen without copyright because of the fact that there will be no barriers to who has the ability to develop upon and implement ideas. Just look at how open source software is at the backbone of everything now-a-days.

by Fawkes; 1645458603; Report

Same, kinda. I've paid for 95% of the games I own, despite my stance on the ethics of it. I have been getting more comfortable with pirating stuff as of late, though. I think I only really avoided it when I was younger because I was paranoid, and because I didn't have anything else I wanted to buy anyway.

by Chelan; 1645458631; Report

Open source software is a good point, and you're correct that my line is arbitrary. I think there's a fundamental difference between software and hardware, though. The cost to develop software is time. The cost to develop hardware varies massively depending on what exactly you're trying to do. Let's say there exists some shiny new design for a safety system that will cut car accident deaths in half, saving almost 20,000 people per year in the U.S., but it needs to be physically prototyped, tested, redesigned and rebuilt n times based on that testing, marked to auto manufacturers, and then produced en masse so it can be rolled out across the country. Is it feasible to think a bunch of random people are going to crowdfund that into existence, with no profit motive? Maybe it's possible, but I think it's way more likely that this idea would simply never be developed.

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I feel like the benefit to hardware designers for creating things is still there, though. if your company designs something, they can develop and mass produce it faster than any other company, and they have a head start on the process of refining it and making it more affordable/efficient/whatever while other companies seek to reverse engineer what your company has developed. the only way you lose this edge is if you just design something and then sit on it, failing to keep up with your competition. in the end I this process is even the most beneficial for consumers, as it makes sure products are always getting better.

by Fawkes; 1645464759; Report

You might enjoy chapter 10 section 7 of this book, which proposes a free market sort of copyright, whee the terms of reproduction are distributed in contract, like software, but similar designs are allowed to propagate naturally.
https://cdn.mises.org/Man,%20Economy,%20and%20State,%20with%20Power%20and%20Market_2.pdf
I find Rothbard's description of this process compelling, but I'm not sure if I buy the fact that market regulation could achieve what he envisions here.

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I think the idea that inventing something means you will almost always be in the best position to roll it out to the market first is valid, but tenuous. I can definitely imagine this leading to large firms with many engineers and lots of production capacity shoving smaller firms out of the market—if one firm can better take advantage of economy of scale, or choose to take losses in order to temporarily dominate the market, etc, and another firm can't, "I did it first" won't help. It's probably possible to avoid that with strict control of trade secrets, and smart negotiation with manufacturers, though.

I like this book. (I've only read the introduction to the chapter, though, since I'm trying to work on other things as well. If I say something dumb about it, that's probably why.) I agree with the idea that copyrights > patents, however, I think the difference between those two things is kind of an edge case, and also pretty difficult to prove in court. It definitely won't solve the main problem I have with IP, which is that people can't legally use this information even when the information is lifesaving, or when the company has already made a huge profit. The book itself says the copyright in this case would be perpetual. It doesn't make sense that someone should have to "independently invent" insulin, before they can manufacture a generic equivalent and start driving down prices, even when the company has had decades to make their profit.

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1000% agree, but I think it's leagues better than our current system, where no one is ever allowed to invent insulin because fuck you.

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And I think that among the lines of promoting innovation vs refinement of designs, it is one of the best solutions I've seen.

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I wonder what pirated game I was playing when this conversation was started.

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what did you do

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Failed to comment on chelan's page for many suns.

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I can't remember the last time you've asked about my balls, Fawkes.

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Is there new balls news?

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Yes. I have acquired 15 nuts to go with my balls.

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That is so awesome.

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